MOD POST: Dear Liberal Members

[sopdetly.livejournal.com]

When I spotted the 100+ comments on the post about the "Ground Zero Mosque", I figured I should peek in there. Perhaps unsurprisingly, I saw that it has grown to such a size because of a few non-right-wing characters who think that this is debate.

THIS COMM IS NOT debate. NOR IS IT conservatism. OR ANY OTHER REGULAR POLITICAL COMM.

This comm was created as a place where right-wing fanfolks could talk politics and not be forced to listen to left-wing yammering, as we have have to do practically everywhere else in fandom. It is not meant to encourage debate between the sides. I hesitate to call it a "safe space", but people don't join this comm to get the kind of arguments that you are providing in that post (and perhaps others of which I am unaware).

I'm not calling you trolls, and I am not (at this time) banning anyone. We do have open membership, and I know that there are less-incendiary liberals watching who either just want to laugh quietly to themselves or honestly want to understand our POVs.

But I want it clear that if you have come to "correct" our posters, "enlighten" us to facts, or otherwise engage us in debate, you are not welcome. (This goes doubly for those who I see are members of a comm whose purpose seems to be to bitch about right-wingers. Do your bitching there, don't bring it here.)

There are plenty of other places where your debate is welcome, and the mods here at TRF respectfully ask that you keep it there and out of this comm. The vast majority of us are right-wing here and we have enough difference in opinion on issues to keep things lively enough without having to defend our positions to the left-wing.

Thank you.

ETA: I know at some point in the history of this comm, there was verbiage similar to this in spirit in the comm's userinfo. At some point it was removed, but this comm was never not intended to be this kind of place. I have added some of this back to the post to make that more clear. If you came here genuinely under the impression that good-natured debate was welcome, I hope you will respect this clarification.

ETA 2: And if you're not even a member and you come in a week later to bitch about the purpose of this comm, you're banned. Simple as that.

Comments

[langostino.livejournal.com]

Except when the facts are checked by those aligned to the opposite side of the debate, people are not going to accept them so easily.

It may be human nature, but should it be community policy? ferahgo and I were basically taking the same line in that post; our rhetoric wasn't, I don't think, all that different. The difference seems to be that on many issues I'm a liberal and ferahgo is a conservative. So (apparently) I'm starting with a presumption of "trolling" or "stirring shit up". I'd like to think that we can all be adults, recognise our tribalist tendencies, and work to get over them. Whether a comment is in or out of line shouldn't depend upon the identity of the commenter, should it?


There are plenty of smart people here who do not come across as antagonistic who can say, "You know, I mostly agree with what you're saying, but this little bit isn't true, and it might change your perspective."

I think my comments on that post basically live up to that qualification.


Perhaps that is what people find demeaning: that you come here to tell us how wrong we are.

Now I don't think I did anything at all like that. Certainly I didn't think to myself that I would tell anybody how wrong they were. The one thing I said was wrong was to compare slitting someone's throat to building a cultural centre, and I think that's a fairly uncontroversial judgment and I stand by it. Most of my comments were of two kinds: providing additional facts, and pointing out that some commenters were calling for a suspension of religious liberty and/or vigilantism (which is a characterisation I don't think they'd dispute).

[sopdetly.livejournal.com]

The difference seems to be that on many issues I'm a liberal and ferahgo is a conservative.

Yes. That is my point. In a group for conservatives that is not meant to invite other points of view for debate, fact-checking from a fellow conservative will be seen in a much better light than from a non-conservative. The latter is going to be immediately perceived as an intruder into our space, uninvited and not very welcome.

You may not find this very fair, but that's what happens when you come into our playground. It is not "community policy" — it just is what it is. Sometimes non-conservatives (like jonathankorman for a timely example) can make a good first impression and keep things polite and become welcome; for whatever reason, you and the others in that post have not done so in the eyes of the comm (in general).

I will also remind you that I have not deemed you or the others to be trolling, nor have I requested you to leave. I have merely clarified the purpose of this community, as it was made clear to me that it might be misunderstood. This is your opportunity to decide if you wish to remain part of this community and adjust your role within it to improve your relationship with the members, or to find that you think you'll be better off not as a member and leave on your own. I have no preference either way.