The Right Fangirl

Your icon amuses me. Although, you'll really piss off the Leftists. Careful.

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bogarteleganza.livejournal.com

I love your icon! :3

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michelle8899.livejournal.com

*sighs*
Its nothing new, I'm afraid. Do any of you remember the incident in West Hollywood I believe it was, it was Hallowentime and someone had a decoration of Sarah Palin hung from a noose. And none of the liberal media found that offensive (even though to me it was obviously a statement of violence aganist women). But you know if it had been B.O. everyone would have lost it.

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Oh, I haven't forgotten. And there was an Obama version in TN, which was removed.

The thing is, the Palin one wasn't legally registered as a hate crime. Hate crimes are there for the minority, as they are more likely to be attacked/maligned, whatever. And that's fine. Unfortunately, white woman are the majority, so, legally speaking, it wouldn't fit the hate crime statute.

Personally, I think the Palin effigy was a hate crime, but it's the usual legal vs. moral debate, and on and on.

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Ugh, why can't I spell singular/plural nouns properly like I used to? Bah.

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kensieg.livejournal.com

I think that today the word racism means this person disagrees with me.

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As a conservative, I don't see increased dialogue about race and racism in the political sphere as problematic.

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Intellectually speaking, I agree. If we had an honest national discussion for race and racism, I'd be for all for it. However, that won't happen because of the Left's screaming racism every two seconds. Then again, if they keep screaming it, then the word loses its effectiveness as a weapon to demonize people (when not apt).

I guess I'm becoming immune by the racist cry, at this point. Which happens when I've seen it done so many times.

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All well and good, but racism still exists, and is still worth talking about, however our imperfect our discourse may be.

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Don't misunderstand me. Racism will always exist, and nothing will change that. I think we've have definitely improved things (Obama's election is proof of that), and Thank God white racism is totally condemned. However, we need to focus on reverse racism next, as "what, only white people can be racists?"

And that's the other problem with the Left's screaming racism every 2 seconds -- because it becomes "the boy who cried Wolf." Whenever you'd have a legitimate reason to say racism, the racist cry will lose any proper effectiveness, due to the overuse.

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LOL "legitimate" according to whom?

Can you give me specific examples about people lying about racism? I mean, that's what you mean when you say "screaming every 2 seconds" right?

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First off, I'd read the link in the entry, as there are some good examples. Also, here is ABC doing a feature on "secret racism." Make of it what you will.

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/scott-whitlock/2009/01/06/abc-again-searches-hidden-racism-everyday-americans

If you want additional examples, I can research, but it will be a while, as my computer isn't reliable, at the moment.

As for "legitimacy," being in the eye of the beholder, I don't disagree, there.

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Are you really going to sit there and say with a straight face that the race card isn't overused?

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Absolutely. If a person expresses feelings of oppression or discrimination, it's not my place to invalidate those feelings. Perhaps they are just being paranoid, or are wrong, or are making it up. But if you are honest and genuine about not being a racist, your initial response to someone's assertion that racism has been perpetuated can't be a knee-jerk dismissal, but inquiry. "It is not!!!" is not an appropriate response, even if it's true. The de facto invalidation of a person's belief is not appropriate in any circumstance. "Why do you feel that way, and what can I do to help?" is a much better response.

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You raise very valid concerns, and it's definitely possible that there is a blase effect, as we're so used to the overuse (plus genuine knee-jerk reactions).

However, like it or not, the racist card is used as intimidation in this day and age. More than ever. Therefore, it's "I'm not allowed to say anything because I'll be feared of being called racist." Which stifles honest conversation, and that isn't good. That's why I roll my eyes at it anymore, as I finally grew a thicker skin (I've dealt with it, too).

I'll say everyone has played it, but the Left does it more, every day.

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I understand what you are saying, and I'm sure that there exist many cases where people used the history of a people's oppression as a way to manipulate a situation or stifle opinions. I think anyone of any race can cite instances of that happening - it's an emotionally charged issue and people will use any emotionally charged issue in sensationalist ways in order to turn the tide to their favor. I think most people on any point of the political spectrum would agree that, once revealed, this kind of behavior is morally reprehensible, and actually injures the cause of equal access to civil liberties for all people.

It's just that for me, personally, I would rather engage in discourse and dialogue with a person to find out why they feel that way than just dismiss it out-of-hand. To me, it's the only compassionate response. If they're being paranoid, perhaps talking it out will reassure them. If they're being opportunistic, dialogue reveals that, too. And there is always the possibility that an instance of racism has occurred that I just didn't pick up on - we all have individual levels of sensitivity to these things, and I don't mean sensitivity as in fragile egos, but the ability to discern specific attitudes. :)

I don't know, I just think that open discussions, even badly conducted ones, can make people think and raise awareness to each other as human beings.

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Your points are incredibly valid, but there are unhinged people, and nothing you can say will convince them of anything.

Case in point: in a Law & Order comm, I was discussing on a character, once, forgetting about this fanbrat with whom I've encountered in the past (whenever I talk about her favorite characters, she appeared to say how wrong I am). We got into it.

I was trying to go onto a deeper point on how the series hasn't had the best track record with minority characters. Then, she laid on "how typical for a white man to say that," then slammed on one of my favorite characters, saying how she's "my fantasy woman," and outright implied I was a racist (even insulted my writing, when there was no context for it). Foaming at the mouth, here.

Then, I realized, "why bother replying, because nothing I say will convince her of anything." Because, once you imply racism when there is no actual reason (at worst, I might have been stupid, but not overtly racist), and you got nothing else, that's it. They've sunk that low, and I was trying to be nice, but...

All you can do is walk away. That's how it is.

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LOL The older I get, the more I try to stay away from fandom because I just don't have the patience for the crazy anymore.

For what it's worth, I am a multiracial Cuban-American and someone who gives a lot of thought to race issues in American society and do not think you've said anything racist in any part of this post, not that you need my validation here, just throwing it out there :D I do think you sound frustrated. I would like to think that Anglo-American people would be less apt to do, think and say racist things, or have racist attitudes, if the discourse on racism were more specific and nuanced rather than expecting "but that's racist!" to be a conversational panacea. Even in the instances where it's true, it blindsides people.

There are two problems with this, as I think your points above illustrate:

1. The level of discourse in our society has hit nearly rock bottom. People don't think critically and can't engage in reasoned civil discourse. People can't be eloquent or persuasive anymore; our school systems don't teach critical thinking or rhetoric or anything that made our founding fathers such effective thinkers and speakers. So that there are a great many people who think "Stop that, that's racist!" is an easily understood, widely meaningful thing to say to anyone, and it's not. It would be if we could assume that everyone we're talking to has a built-in practice of historical awareness and critical thinking but, lol, as you experienced, that's not the case.

2. I also think that people don't distinguish between "that's a racist thing to say/do" and "you're a racist, you jerk!" In my mind, a racist is someone who is complicit, either deliberately or via ignorance, with the social practice of distinguishing between "races" of people for the purpose of lessening the quality of life of one or more of those races. (I don't think there is such a thing as race, but we all act as though there is, so that just boils down to semantics.) You can NOT be a racist, yet inadvertently say something that perpetuates racism. You can be not-a-racist and still say racist things, in other words.

People on all sides of the issue have a hard time distinguishing between these. People say "You're a racist!" when they really meant, "I felt like that was a racist thing to say, and since we both agree racism is a bad thing, do you think you could re-evaluate what you just said? thanks." People also hear "You're a racist!" when someone just said "But that was a racist thing to say."

Sorry I wrote a novel...

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Well, my final point, before I was cut off (damn computer), was how the fanbrat successfully scared me about speaking about race. Until I read on the AP screaming racism on Palin's white jacket and her talking about Ayers six months later. To wit, "if the Left is screaming racism about a white jacket, then I should re-think everything."

I'll admit, I'm quite frustrated about the issue itself (and the Left's use of the issue). But I wanted to know your angle before I finally asked on why you kept pressing me on the issue. I don't mind it, as we need the debate, and like the fanbrat, this has been instructive.

Definitely agree on the rest of your points. So, we good? Hee.

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We are totally good :D I was just making conversation, so thanks for engaging me here!!

I am an avid supporter of Gov. Palin and look forward to her lengthy future career in politics. I'll concede that if anyone told me wearing a white jacket was the sign of racism, I would assume they were delusional, which, to be fair, is my primary assumption when listening to the media talk about Governor Palin. :D

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Sure.

I think the media over Palin and over that, proved how we're sick of the "raaaacism" argument. So, that explains why some of us are acting like we have (well, speaking for myself). Maybe we shouldn't, but that's the Left's effect for you.

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Why can't dismissal be my default reaction at this point? The fact that something is frequently claimed to be happening but, in my experience, almost never is shifts my default reaction to skepticism every time the claim is made. I have neither the time nor the patience at this point to play softball with the feelings of every random person I come across; Lord knows I've tried in the past.

One can only be called a racist for trying to help so many times before one stops giving a damn.

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Why can't dismissal be my default reaction at this point?

Erm. Because it's rude, superior and not a socially healthy way to treat other people? I can't really understand how that's a real question. Are you in all seriousness asking why you can't dismiss with impunity and by default any attempt to talk about racism? If you're going to act like that, people will call you on it. The world doesn't owe you the indulgence of your social preferences.

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The world doesn't owe you the indulgence of your social preferences.

So you're saying that nobody owes me the indulgence of my social preferences, but that I owe you the indulgence of yours.

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No, you don't owe anyone anything. However, it isn't realistic to expect to be dismissive toward everyone, but also except for anyone to like, listen to or respect you. Your behavior has social consequences and informs other people about you. No one likes to be dismissed; it's rude and uncivil. But really, this isn't something people should need to be telling you.

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